East-Asian Drug Policy
I've decided to put an interesting twist on today's article. Rather than rant or rave about this topic, I'd instead like to begin a facilitated discussion on what people know, think, and believe of the way East-Asian politics conducts the treatment of drug crimes, and the penalties that result.
Please direct ideas and discussion to the comments section :)
- Josh
posted by Josh at 2:30 a.m.
23 Comments:
Some history on East-Asian drug policy:
- penalties for possession and/or trafficking have become very severe in the second half of the 20th century (1950-present).
- those caught are charged and face almost immediate trial.
- the average sentence handed down to drug criminals ranges from 20 year in prison to death by firing squad.
- Sentencing is the same for criminals caught with Class A drugs (i.e. Cocaine, Heroin, etc.) and Class B drugs (i.e. Marijuana).
- the existing policy refuses extradition of foreigners to their home country for punishment.
Thoughts?
-Josh
In comparison what exactly are the policies on these drugs in Canada? Overall, I don't necessarily think that their policies are over the top, except for marijuana. I have a hard time understanding how people can justify the leagalization of alcohol but not marijuana (I'm assuming alcohol is legal in these countries). When it comes to all mind altering substances the question is 'where do you draw the line?'
Here's what I've been thinking...
Legalize all drugs and allow the government to distrubute them. This allows for knowledge of how the drug is produced, made etc. It also allows for governments to create safe injection sites (which will lesson the risk for the spread of HIV/AIDS). It also allows the government to create awareness of the dangers of dangerous drugs such as LSD, Meth, Coke, Heroine. The end result? You drive the demand down by increasing the supply which makes the drug very cheap. Simple supply-demand economics. Thus, drugs will be too cheap for dealers to have an inncentive to distrubute. There is no financial incentive. Problem solved. Any thoughts?
-Sam
I 100% disagree with the punishments. The reason why they don't want drugs is because they are severely dangerous to the people who are taking them...but so is the death penalty. Threatening imprisonment and death are no way to get rid of drugs; instead they should be implementing rehabs for those who are addicted. They are just using drugs as an excuse to kill off more of their citizens. Yum.
Though scare tactics may seem like a fine alternative, and the death penalty a fitting punishment for for the back door buddy criminals. We do live in a country that prides itself on not allowing capital punishment. Yes the burden upon taxes payers to clothe and feed the sum of the earth would be eliminated by instigating a death penalty. This enforcement would have to also be accompanied by an overhaul of the legal system which would never happen. I think I would rather have a prisoner rot in a prison cell without the luxury of a normal existence then get off easy by being executed. I believe in the system in place for a punishment fitting the crime though there is room for improvement. "An eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind"
I don't think every drug should be made legal. Heroin and Cocaine are serious physically addicting life ruining drugs. In my opinion there's no place for these drugs and there should be dire consequences for the use/distribution. The government should take no part in legalizing and distributing drugs like these. On the other hand i dont see something like an MLCBO (Marijuana and Liquor Control Board of Ontario) as such a ridiculous idea. There IS a line.
There's also the matter of looking at the root of the problem. Often politicians like to look for simple solutions such as longer jail sentenses for first time offenders. This only creates a backlog of cases and crowded jails. What we need to do is look at the ROOT of the problem. In this case extreme poverty and perhaps providing better support for low income families (especially single women).
-Sam
I completely and whole-heartedly take the side of those who believe strict punishment is necessary. I think unless you are exposed to the destruction that drugs can cause to a person and those surrounding them, it is simple to say legalize or ease penalties. What we're dealing with is a global pandemic, and unless the rest of the world follows East-Asia, the underground drug industry will still to generate over $1 Billion annually in Canada, and tens of billions worldwide. Think about it this way - are you more likely to commit a crime if the consequences are a slap on the wrist and a criminal record, or death?
Yes, I agree those who are involved in drugs need rehabilitation, but not as an excuse or an out from being penalized for their demoralizing of society first. If they want help without fear of consequence, then they need to ask for it before trying to make money by destroying the lives of others by transporting and selling drugs.
And in terms of extraditing people to their own country for a softer penalty? NO! You pay the price where you committed the crime - end of story. These people knew the consequences but took the risk because it would mean receive substantially greater profits. This is greed at the expense of humanity.
If you legalize drugs of any sort, then you risk a serious reduction in productivity, a general decay of ethics and morals, the destruction of countless lives, and an altogether collapse of the world economy as we know it.
-Josh
Quoting Josh - "If you legalize drugs of any sort, then you risk a serious reduction in productivity, a general decay of ethics and morals, the destruction of countless lives, and an altogether collapse of the world economy as we know it."
I'd argue that alcohol is a drug of some sort that decays ethics and morals and destroys lives. So I'll ask again, WHERE IS THE LINE?
Two things...
1) The death penalty is ridiculous. As someone commented above, it allows for criminals to receive the easy way out. What could be worse punishment than living with the guilt of the crime you committed? Also, countless amounts of innocent people on Death Row have been executed for crimes they did not commit. If I was convicted of using drugs in countries in East-Asia and I was innocent, there's no hope in hell of saving my life. In the event of an execution, you get rid of the committer of the crime. What about this criminal's following? Are they going to stop using because one of their peers was executed? It's rather difficult to do that once you're addicted. Instead of killing off all drug users, rehab programs must be put in place and education on the effects of drug use should be provided for those considering using. This is the only way of ridding a society of drugs.
2) The death penalty for the use of minor drugs is even more ridiculous than the death penalty in general. In Canada, what happens if you're caught smoking up? You barely get a slap on the wrist. In East-Asia, you're executed. This is why I believe Canada is such a leader in this issue. Rather than cracking down on the use of minor substances, funds in the legal system are brought to deal with more serious crimes. Wouldn't you rather your tax money go towards the incarceration of a murderer who could committ a crime against a member of your family than someone who was caught with a gram?
I think that Canadian citizens often overlook how fortunate we are to live in this great country of ours. As a progressive nation, we can set the standards for other less-fortunate countries around the world and hope that they follow our democratic footsteps. It's time Canadians started taking a global stance and appreciating our situation; one where we are free to engage in discussions on issues such as this.
I completly agree with anonymous!
-Sam
It's definately a tough issue, but I'm hearing a lot of good arguments.
If I may add, this isn't just about the death penalty, the verdict normally results in 20 years to life in prison, which coincides with what anonymous had been supporting. But in relation to your comments on Canada being so much more ahead of the world in their war on drugs, I would have to disagree with you. If you look up the drug rate for Indonesia and other East-Asian countries, the numbers are close to zero, compared to Canada which is certainly not. I think you need to also put in perspective the idea that by putting up a tough fight on drugs, East-Asia has gone from slums to satisfactory/acceptable in terms of living standards. Something must be working.
Also, in terms of what Kyle said, I think the line is drawn when the world community looks at statistics and decides which battles to fight. Tobacco and alcohol are so commonplace like davb said, and many programs are put in place to reduce or eliminate their consumption. New stats released in 2005 show for the first time in history, the world is reducing their consumption of cigarettes and alcohol. Although not everything can be fully abolished, that's no reason to make it a free-for-all where anything goes and all drugs are legalized.
And to reiderate once more, drug pedallers deserve our help in reversing their trends and receiving treatment, but not as an alternative to serving jail time if they have been caught and are guilty of the crime (having not asked for help prior), because if they hadn't been caught, they wouldn't be seeking help. It's just a cop-out.
- Josh
I believe it is the people smuggling and selling drugs that should be put in jail for 20 years, and no early parole. The people taking drugs have addictive personalities, so rehab is the only solution. Even then, their predisposition to addiction is something that they must struggle with their whole lives. Throw the sellers in jail, not the buyers. I would much rather see the death penalty for child abusers (who are usually repeat offenders) than for those who take drugs. Perhaps the death penalty for the drug sellers is the answer. In the early part of the last century, there was prohibition. Selling and drinking alcohol was illegal. It didn't stop people from doing either - it just went underground with speakeasy's, and secret clubs. While drunk driving kills many, I have yet to see stats on crimes committed by someone high on marijuana. And while we're at it, I think prostitution should be legalized. It would be cleaner and safer for all involved. I don't think legalizing hard drugs is the answer, though, to getting people to stop, and I think it puts the government in the position of drug pusher. And, while I believe Canada may be seen as progressive, too many criminals are getting off too easy on many fronts. Canada just won't take a hard stand on crime. That doesn't make it better than East-Asia, it just makes them different.
MB
I think everyone needs to read A Million Little Pieces. a) becasue it is an amazing book, b) it shows how badly drugs can fuck up your life, and c)all of the above.
Haha...I was about to suggest that book because I have read it too and I agree with Vanessa that is amazing. I read it in 2 days (450 pages). It really is amazing. I don't think it matters that it was ridden with scandal over his over-exaggerate and outright lies; the message is still the same. Read it.
-Sam
*over-exaggeration
You can't over-exaggerate. You can only exaggerate!
english teacher at-large
I think that if there were stricter drug laws in Canada, perhaps we wouldn't have the problems we have. I do think that Asian laws are very archaic and steps need to be put in place to loosen their laws (putting it midly), but I think that other countries around the world should toughen up their drug laws.
Lisa Freid
Toronto
Agreed. So what if he exaturated some things. If people are really concerd about weather what they are reading is whole truths or half lies, then at least look at the bigger picture. The bible, or Torah, can easily be said to hold many fabricated, and or exaturated stories, not to mention that they can also be considered completly biased, seeing as one religon wrote it. One perspective, one side of the story. A million little pieces is about triump, and challenge, and strugling to overcome obstacles. Does it matter if its true or not? No. What matters is that thoes who read it, can take somthing away from the story. becasue underneeth it all thats what it is. a story. even if it was 100% it is still a story.
*even if it was 100% true. It is still just a story.
MIDNIGHT EXPRESS
I'm glad you brought that up!Midnight Express is definately recommended for those who enjoyed the context and debate surrounding this article. It revolves around the true story of a young American caught smuggling drugs out of Turkey, and the resulting treatment he received in a barbaric prison. It carries special relevance to the case we've all been discussing.
-Josh
It just shows that people are oblivious to other cultural societies and regulations. Smugglers believe that what ever they can get away with in North America, it will work in these countries.
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